geno
dubsartur (junior scribe)
Posts: 7
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Post by geno on Sept 17, 2019 16:48:14 GMT -5
Hello everyone, I teach 6th grade ancient world history, and am also a cancer survivor. I’m wanting a tattoo that ties in to both of these. I’m sure the phrase f*#k cancer probably won’t translate into Sumerian or Akkadian, but would there be anything close to it? Maybe a curse or something towards cancer? I’d love to get it tattooed on my arm in cuneiform near my orange ribbon that is getting done tonight. I am grasping at straws here, and would appreciate any guidance that y’all could give. Thanks, Geno
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Post by us4-he2-gal2 on Sept 21, 2019 11:10:13 GMT -5
Hello Geno - As you may notice on other threads on this board, I think it is a good idea to take the time and research here at enenuru before getting a cuneiform tattoo, for sure. Well, the reason is that these ancient languages and writing systems are complex and there are many ways in which a modern tattoo could end up being inauthentic (or ungrammatical). The first question we may need to address is whether you want the message itself to be in Sumerian or Akkadian? The writing system is cuneiform for both. Both are ancient languages dating back to the 3rd millennium BC Mesopotamia. Above you seem to say either one, so maybe it would come down to whichever language can better articulate the meaning?
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geno
dubsartur (junior scribe)
Posts: 7
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Post by geno on Sept 21, 2019 23:07:31 GMT -5
Yes, I do understand the history of the script as I do teach about the region to my sixth graders. Actually, they are working on a Mesopotamian project right now. As far as which language you are correct, either one as long as it would convey the message best. I have looked and tried to see what I could figure out on my own, but I’m running into so many snags and don’t know enough to get it done correctly. This is why I’ve came here seeking help.
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geno
dubsartur (junior scribe)
Posts: 7
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Post by geno on Sept 21, 2019 23:18:50 GMT -5
I just reread my post and it almost sounds curt. It’s not meant that way. What I’m trying to say is I understand the complexity of the task, and my limited understanding of the languages is a real difficulty and because of that I’m seeking help from people who understand it much better than myself. I am not finding anything that would be close, and the word cancer that I find I believe is in relation to the constellation. I don’t know if that would be correct either. Again, I’m overwhelmed and would appreciate the help.
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Post by us4-he2-gal2 on Sept 27, 2019 11:19:46 GMT -5
Hello Geno -
So I have had a look at some of the Akkadian and Sumerian dictionaries and so on. Yes, it would appear that a word for cancer does not occur in these ancient languages so far as we know currently. Notice my wording in that sentence is very deliberate. Assuming cancer afflicted some Mesopotamians (which is my assumption), there are at least two likely reasons that we do not currently have a Mesopotamian word for cancer: a) the ancients themselves did not categorize this as a distinct disease, or used generalized illness terminology when referring to cancer in texts; or b) modern Assyriology has either not uncovered the textual material that would yield a Mesopotamian word yield evidence for such a word (possible as much remains buried) or modern scholars have not been successful in identifying which Mesopotamian word relates to cancer. The work of identifying Mesopotamian lexical values is tedious and will probably never be entirely complete - especially for Sumerian words when we are entirely dependent on translations made by the ancient Akkadians for our understanding of Sumerian values. In the same way that lists of Sumerian plants and trees remain partially understood by modern scholars so do lists of illnesses. Although the amount of medical texts recovered is considerable and an great amount of scholarly work has gone in to their analysis, all said and done, we can be reasonable confident that we don't have a Mesopotamian word for cancer.
Which means that you would have to make a choice here - the choice would be whether to proceed with an analogical cuneiform tattoo or not. That is, a tattoo which makes a Mesopotamian analogy to the message you want. Something like the Mesopotamian namtar demon, a demon which brings illness and who is often mentioned in exorcistic texts as a bringer of illness, would have to stand in for the word cancer, I think.
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geno
dubsartur (junior scribe)
Posts: 7
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Post by geno on Sept 27, 2019 14:58:27 GMT -5
Us4-he2-gal2 I like the logic of using namtar. If I’m understanding correctly even the astrology sign cancer is later as well, and would that really be the proper word used for the astrological sign at the time? I’m currently sitting at teaching inservices and we have a section that we can do “on demand “ training since a lot of the district training does not meet my history teacher needs I’m using this time to learn more about Mesopotamia as this is one of my weaknesses in my knowledge base.
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Post by us4-he2-gal2 on Sept 30, 2019 7:20:58 GMT -5
Geno: The Mesopotamian constellation translated in English as 'cancer' is in Sumerian kušu and in Akkadian alluttum. Both of these words translate to "crab". Indicating the influence of Mesopotamian astrology on classical Greek astrology, the word "cancer" is actually a Greek (or Greco-Roman) term also meaning "crab". The same constellation in all of these ancient systems and languages is the 'crab' constellation. As for the disease, which by a quick google search I read seems to have been mentioned by the Greeks around 500 BC and long before by the Egyptians (but again, somehow not by the Mesopotamians) seems to have been dubbed cancer "crab" simply because of the apparent shape of some tumors. This is what I am reading on a misc. website at least: www.news-medical.net/health/Cancer-History.aspx Should that be the case, as far as I can tell it is, then the use of the image of the crab for the constellation and for the disease is incidental. The name of the disease does not refer to the constellation or vice verse, both simply draw independently from the animal (or crustacean). It seems to me the best way to go may still be to make some phrase with the demon namtar or similar demon, if that is the way you want to go.
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geno
dubsartur (junior scribe)
Posts: 7
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Post by geno on Oct 27, 2019 19:49:28 GMT -5
I’m in agreement, “cancer” is out and NamTar would be the way to go. Sorry for the absence, but things have been hectic here lately getting ready for conferences, thank goodness those are over!
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Post by us4-he2-gal2 on Nov 2, 2019 9:31:26 GMT -5
Okay, well then the way to get an authentic sounding Mesopotamian tattoo to ward off illness is to refer to the texts which deal with that sort of thing. Obviously operating a long long time before the advent of modern scientific medicine, Mesopotamians took a magico-medical approach to sickness. According to their worldview, illness was not caused by internal problems but was the result of the evil and polluting influence of a demon (or witch or ghost). Demons, who were generally understood as the agents of the divine, sent as the result of some divine displeasure, were countered through exorcistic incantations and rituals. A book published by M. Geller Forerunners to Udug-Hul contains modern translations of such exorcistic incantations, one of which contains a phrase like 'evil namtar... be you adjured by heaven, be you adjured by earth!' . This is a typical formula for expelling a demon in these texts, it appeals to the (divine authorities) over heaven and earth to caste the demon out of the body. Perhaps you may want to use a phrase like this?
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geno
dubsartur (junior scribe)
Posts: 7
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Post by geno on Dec 28, 2019 12:00:25 GMT -5
Sorry for the long absence. Yes, a phrase like that would be perfect.
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