So you want to be an Assyriologist?

[us4-he2-gal2]

Thread Orientation: On this thread we may focus and co-ordinate an effort to frame the field of Assyriology, it's promise, intrigue and danger for those approaching commitment or for those past that point.

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So you want to be an Assyriologist?

Abstract (from the Nov. enenuru periodical)/


"Some of you layman, like myself, have had their imaginations and/or intellects engaged by this field of study to such a degree that you may, overtly or covertly, have entertained a certain want - yes the want to be an Assyriologist. Few layman with even a strong interest in these studies can simply say “I want to be an Assyriologist” however, at least if they have some inclination of the specialized linguistic learning that has traditionally gone with that commitment. Because the outside world, to include one’s immiediate family and friends, unskilled workplace, and especially home environment (with the typical mass media and blend of fiction and fantasy novels) has no hint or wit of the world of the professional philologist, saying “I want to be an Assyriologist” can for the longest time sound almost like “I want to be the Easter bunny.”
If one does persist with this determination to the extent serious consideration is given to the profession, an impressive array of personal and professional concerns present themselves: even if one does have the personnel conviction that they can engage a field originally populated by the genius or rich of society (and still representing a knowledge elite), the educational options are nothing short of daunting. How does an unskilled workman go about getting into say Harvard or Oxford for example? And then assuming one does survive some 7 to 10 years of kraft diner and city bus trips, the job prospects for the successful graduate or PhD in Assyriology seem to be universally reported as something like “abysmal”, the field itself “in trouble.” In the volume “The Study of the Ancient Near East in the 21st Century”, P. Michalowski writes that because “the resistance of the establishment is so strong and the job prospects so bad” students are inclined to over-specialize in philology, avoiding interdisciplinary subjects. He speaks of a “financial crises in higher learning” and the “changing intellectual climate in institutions of higher learning” and adds “it’s not secret the ancient Near East studies, and Assyriology in particular are in danger in American universities.”
Surely there is some relief for this bleak and unlikely portrait of the want to be an Assyriologist (or of my want to be an Assyriologist)? Not necessarily! On a new thread to be placed in the Sumerologistics section at enenuru, and titled “So you want to be an Assyriologist?” I will collect the various perspectives and indicators that will form a balenced outlook on this matter. I will send out special invitations to our members in the field and may entice some to share their perspectives – and lastly I will write an email to [Respectfully censored] (that’s right, Canada’s only practicing professor of Assyriology!) and will report back."

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Next up... I will ask our friend Sohnyrinn, "how did you get to your studies?" She is a fellow Canadian who has gone where few Canadians have gone before!

[sohnyrin]

" She is a fellow Canadian who has gone where few Canadians have gone before!"

Did you mean in the dept of madness ? Because that's about where I am right now... But I guess it's what suits me !

I was young and in Belgium for obscure reasons.. I was contemplating the history bachelor program at Université Libre de Bruxelles when I had to go back to Montreal. I found a small program at Université de Montréal,(Lucky me, I just hated all the history classes I had...) a school that was founded at the time of the "révolution tranquile" when Québecois (inhabitants of the province of Québec) decided to fund public services by the government instead of by the church (catholic). It was a non-confessional program called "religious sciences" now renamed "sciences of religion". I did the 3 years required under a very nice director (Pr. Mathieu Boisvert) that let me choose my courses almost as I wish. Outside my departement, I had archeology classes at Université de Montréal and biblical Hebrew at Concordia, also courses in the history and philosophy departments of my school. My main focus was on Hinduism (I did a final project of 4 months in India, I lived with the "Doms", a caste that burns the dead) but I kept orienting all my other works towards ancient Japan and Mesopotamia. After a year and a half in my program, I decided that studying would be my life. I wanted to be a researcher. I chose a subject for my master, Mesopotamia was my baby and I had to choose between archeology and languages. After writing to some teachers I finally decided on languages :
I e-mailed Pr. Antoine Cavigneaux and he seemed very happy and interested with the idea that I come study in his department. Cavigneaux is a sumerologist, also very well versed in akkadian and archeology. He just had his 60th birthday and started reading cuneiform at about 10. I couldn't find better
My program is called languages and civilizations of Mesopotamia, it's in the department of "antiquities" (it's multidisciplinary, just as my old department) under the faculty of "letters" in Université de Genève.
It's my second year now. I haven't choose my thesis subject yet, I might take half a year extra to make it through since Cavigneaux made ma take all the courses of the B.A. to be up-to-date,meaning that i'm currently having Akkadian 2 and 3 at the same time and having my Sumerian 2 exam in Feburary instead of in June.

I'm totally broke, life is so expensive here... At least I have a work permit for half time work, thank you Switzerland !

I'm firmly decided to pursue a doctorate afterward, probably in archeology. I'm looking at schools right now... If my German gets better, I might consider Germany but for now I'm very interested in Université de Lyon since they have a study group that focuses on death remains/finds in Mesopotamia, and associate groups working on texts.

I can't say that I'm an assyriologist, but I'm firmly decided to become a university teacher in my field and I will not fail, no matter how long and how many sacrifices it will take. ;D

[us4-he2-gal2]

Thank you Sohnyrin - Very interesting studies! I'm sure I personally won't be given the opportunity or options for so varied an education, or such diversity of interest! Being so short on time. Hopefully your experience indicates there are more then one, maybe many, ways in which one can come to Assyriological study.

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Reflections on the life of

S.N. Kramer

I have below taken some notes from of Kramer's book "In the Land of Sumer" which was this scholar very unique autobiography. I was quite surprised to come across it and in the word's of M.Civil, who introduced the book: "This is the first time, if I am not mistaken, that a cuneiformist scholar has bared his soul in a printed autobiography." The book is undeniably an acquired taste, but would be of special interest to the Mesopotamian enthusiast and of course for our effort here to frame the prospects of specialized Near Eastern studies. Particularly relevant to this thread is the information on how Kramer came to his studies (largely due to a upbringing of Jewish learning) and especially the heading "finances and Sumerology" is important to note I believe.


Kramer as a youth/


This book may bring the most direct answer to a question such as 'how does one become a Sumerologist in 1930's America anyway?' To remember Kramer seems to me to be in some way a belated recognition of his accomplishments, which never were never reliably known in his time, and which are in large part still un-heralded at least by the public at large.

Samuel Noel Kramer was born in 1897 in Zashkov Ukraine, and was from a strongly Jewish family - his father taught the Torah, and the Kramer's spoke Yiddish. In his youth, Kramer attended Hebrew school and his name in full was Simcha Noach Kramer, however the family moved to Russia in 1905 to avoid anti-semitism and his name was latanised to Samuel Noah Kramer. In America, Kramer excelled in the elementary school system and he was enrolled in a 'yeshiva' a Jewish religious school he attended between 4 and 7 days of the week. He then attended southern high, and replaced the yeshiva with Gratz college, where courses were taught in English as oppose to Yiddish and he learned Jewish grammar and history from a more 'secular' perspective - he received top honors and at the college's seventy fifth jubilee he presented an article that dealt with a Sumerian goddess- quite out of context at a Jewish college.

After southern high there was no funds for higher education, so Kramer enrolled in the Philadelphia School of Pedagogy, which offered 2 yrs free preparatory courses. Here he developed an interest in American literature and Western philosophy, becoming secretary of the Philosophy club. Around this time his Jewish Orthodoxy began to wain and he stopped attending the synagogue and observing the Sabbath.


Utilizing Hebrew Learnings/

Kramer had a brief stint in the army but it was 1917 & WW1 ended before he was deployed, afterward he lived on his own and was soon doing most of the teaching at his fathers Hebrew school, and he taught here throughout the twenties. For a few years Kramer pursued his literary interest hoping to become a novelist or dramatist but years of unsuccessful submissions caused him to give that up - he had a brief stint as a partner in a new printing business but realized he had little business sense after the business bombed. Eventually, he turned back to academia "it came to me that I might go back to my beginnings and try to utilize the Hebrew learning on which I had spent much of my youth". He enrolled in the Dropsie College of Philadelphia for Hebrew and Cognate Learning.


Kramer attends the U of Pennsylvania/

Here there were many impressive minds, scholars of Talmudic, Judeo-Arabic, and Egyptian learning. What interested Kramer most was Egpytology, he studied for two years under Nathaniel Reich and "knew almost by heart" the best Egyptian grammar published to date. Kramer had a falling out with Reich however, and left that college to study at Oriental studies department of the Graduate School of the University of Pennsylvania. When Kramer joined the department in 1928 he worked under Ephraim Speiser, and after two year's of Speiser's tutelage Kramer wrote his dissertation which analyzed tablets written in Akkadian, the dissertation "bore the unexciting title "The Verb in the Kirkuk Tablets". By 1930 Kramer had a doctorate of Oriental Studies from the Graduate School of the University of Pennsylvania. "The problem was what to do with it." He applied for and received a fellowship (grant of $2000) from the newly offering American Council of Learned Science's - this was funding for his studies for a year. (though it was the 30's).


Kramer in Iraq, Landsberger and Poebel/

Kramer toured some of the archaeological collections in Europe's better museums to familiarize himself with his new field, meeting Speiser for some planned excavations in Iraq in the fall of 1930. He was disenchanted on first seeing modern Baghdad and Iraq "could this sun-parched wind-riven, desert-like land have been the home of heroic Gilgamesh, the celebrated ruler of Erech of the broad marts?". Though his party did not find material of the same magnitude as Woolley's excavation of the Ur tombs (from that same period), Kramer's faith in the unique significance of Mesopotamian culture was renewed and before returning to Philadelphia he worked with Benno Landsberger (a mastermind in Oriental studies) who helped him publish for the Journal of the American Oriental Society (1932) the Sumerian study "New tablets from Farah". The Assyrian dictionary project in the 30's was one the main project's at the Oriental institute, and Arno Poebel had been elected as scientific editor, Poebel was also professor of Sumerology, a chair unique to that university at the time. And he taught Sumerian grammar. On returning from Iraq, Kramer would become Poebel's 'disciple' and hone his grasp of the Sumerian language. Their relationship disintegrated however, in the 1933 when Poebel displayed decidedly anti-semitic leanings toward Kramer. Though devastated Kramer would later dedicate his major work to Poebel.



The rest of the book "In the world of Sumer" focus's mainly on Kramer's academic career and Sumerological discoveries, indeed the lines between his private life and intellectual endeavors become almost irrelevant - one is the other and vice versa. The content of the book soon begins to mirror entire passages from "The Sumerians" one begins to suspect he is reliving the writing of his greatest work through the writing of the auto-biography, but this may reflect that to some extent Kramer became his work for periods of his life. A few lines do relate that he married in 1933 and had 2 sons.


Finances and Sumerology/

What is clear is that Sumerology is not financially rewarding, every expedition Kramer made to Istanbul or Europe or wherever un- translated Cuneiform lay in forgotten museum storage, was depended on grants of two or three thousand dollars - and this generally to feed a family of four for x number of months to a year or more. His spending habits seem to be frugal throughout his life, and even at the height of his scholarly prestige Kramer waved royalties in favor of an upfront payment of $300 for one particular book - if he hadn't had the cash forwarded, he wouldn't have had the funding to prepare and write it!


Work and Religiosity/

On the rare time Kramer hints at a sympathy to the religion he has helped raise from obscurity, it is likely though that this is out of fondness rather then genuine religiosity. In 1941 Kramer read a 29 min paper on the Descent of Inanna to the American Philosophical society, a reporter for the New York times wrote a 2 column article on the speech and the attention helped secure him a position as associate curator in the Babylonian section of the University museum "at last i was in a relatively secure academic post." This prompted what could be called a degree -however minor- of reverence for Inana "No wonder Inanna became my guardian angel, and I have clung to her throughout my career, even when to my dismay i learned that she had a destructive, death-dealing side to her character." 3 times in the book he refers to sudden good changes in fortune with lines like 'my Sumerian lama did not abandon me' - lama is a beneficent female deity usually unnamed. And toward the end he writes that working on his later cuneiform projects " has proved to be the breath of life for me, the prolongation of my years, and has enabled me to keep writing at my desk, today, in my eighty-sixth year."

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Still to come... Do we have any other members who would convey their insights from the field? Especially regarding entry and preparatory learning for this Assyriological studies would be wonderful

[cynsanity]

Well... my story is quite boring, actually. I went to school in a special Bundesrealgymnasium for natural sciences, and had decided to study theoretical physics, as my other interests, philosophy and psychology, would either make me unemployed or... unemployed. I had accidentally found a book in which some Mesopotamian myths were mentioned (Ishtar's Descent to the Netherworld, Nergal and Ereshkigal, Enki(g) and Ninhursanga, Enlil and Ninlil) some months before finishing school, and had fallen in love with the culture. By chance, I flipped through the university-guide for Austria, and realised that I could actually study the history, cultures and languages of Mesopotamia. As I had taken Latin in school, I didn't have a problem with that mandatory stuff, so I enrolled, started studying and haven't stopped since, currently working on my thesis. And hope to find my niche with it.

We're called "Institute for Ancient Semitic Philology and Oriental Archaeology", part of the Institute of Orientalistics. After completing the first half of your studies, you can choose one out of four different specialisations:
- Assyriology
Akkadian, Akkadian, Akkadian and nothing but Akkadian.

- Comparative Semitistics
Akkadian and at least two Northwest Semitic languages

- Sumerology
Akkadian and Sumerian, Sumerian, Sumerian

- Oriental Archaeology
Akkadian, and Archaeology, Archaeology and Archaeology. Sometimes also digging.

The environment here in Vienna is quite relaxed. The best is expected from everyone, and those who just either don't have any sort of talent for the subject matter get treated differently - no one really cares if they're doing something right or wrong. Some ore subject to open dislike and ridicule from the staff (which is funny for the rest of us). Unless you want to focus on archaeology, it is recommended you take the language courses that are offered, even if you don't have to do them or feel like doing it. In the past 4 years, I've not just learned Akkadian, Sumerian and Bible Hebrew, as everyone has to, but also Hittite, Ugaritic, Proto-Sinaitic, Canaanite, Phoenician, Moabite, Ancient Epigraphic Hebrew, Old South Arabian and Middle Egyptian (sadly, I missed the Elamite course by one semester... *curses*).

Getting any sort of paid work, though, can be tricky. Everyone is worrying about their jobs at the moment, and you can expect to be unemployed until you got your PhD, unless you are selected for one of the programs that Prof. Jursa is running (he mainly focuses on late Babylonian, Seleucid and Achaemenid periods, which is a bit... young... for my tastes). The current trend over here is to go to Munich, Leipzig or Berlin.

Sumerology and religious history as well as history of the 3rd millennium up to Hammurapi is Prof. Selz's area. He's quite snarky and demands a lot, but can be funny if you understand his sort of cynicism. Very good teacher.

Akkadian and Comparative Semitistics are Prof. Jursa's corner. He's weird. A genius, but weird.

Archaeology is formally led by Dr. Luciani, who is on baby-break for this semester.

Prof. Hunger occasionally teaches as well, as does Prof. Jaros, a biblical scholar who's brilliant and also teaches religious history of Syria and Palestine.

So... yeah.

[us4-he2-gal2]

Nadia: This post is wondrous And while wandering these dark note strewn corridors and contemplating future uncertainties, I will no doubt stop to treasure it again. Thank you ...*lunges for YIM*

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__________________________

Week 1 - Bill writes determinedly to

Canada's Only Teaching Assyriologist

(So good we only need one? 0_0)

_______________________

As promised in the Nov. Periodical, I have written Canada's only Assyriologist that is currently teaching introductory Assyrian and Babylonian. This teaching is done through the only department which features significant Mesopotamian studies, the Department of Near and Middle Eastern Civilizations at the U. of Toronto.

So I promised myself that I would send this mail, and have absolutely no apprehension in doing so - I am writing to request perspective on a wish to enter into these studies at Toronto. I certainly will produce the exchange candidly below, if [Respectfully censored] approves a request to share his advice I will add his response plainly below - if I don't get that approval confirmed, will paraphrase to a respect degree. And, if I get entirely no response whatsoever, I would find this as educating and indicative for those who "want to be an Assyriologist" as anything.



e-mail number 1

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Mr. [Respectfully censored]:

I have not written to you before, but I have for quite some time thought of the potential of doing so. If I can ask for a moment of your time, I would explain that I am a person with an unusual attachment for Mesopotamian studies, and I hope that my years of appreciative reading and note taking on the subject suggest an aptitude as well. I have the problem of resolutely maintaining a hope for a path towards these studies, however perilous such a path may be, yet find my Queen's University to lack the necessary program. Further, academic counselors I have so far spoken to at Queen's haven't been able to give me insight as to what my next steps toward an ultimate goal of Assyriology should be.

As I consider you to be Canada's only teaching Assyriologist, I hope it is not impertinent for me to request some small perspective (at what would be a very timely point for me.) If you consider it appropriate, I would send you a more detailed mail with a few specific questions. If you think it would be better for me to direct this at another member of the NMC staff however, I would appreciate this suggestion as well.

Thanks very much!

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Still to come.... A response from Mr. [Respectfully censored]?

[amarsin]

So cynsanity-- do you know Ronan? I think he was there a year or two ago, working with Jursa. (I feel like I've asked this before; maybe not.)

[sheshki]

Lets hope he didnt google your name and found your elvis impersonator profile... ;D.
www.gigmasters.com/elvisimpersonator/OneNightWithYou/

[adante]

You will probably get a much better response and a tun of help that way!

I came across an archeology website here and discovered the only way I can do studies in ANE is to first do a batchelor of arts or science, then do a year's postgrad in archeology. So this year, I'm starting my BA in religious studies

[amarsin]

Jan 23, 2009 19:25:41 GMT -5 adante said:

You will probably get a much better response and a tun of help that way!

I came across an archeology website here and discovered the only way I can do studies in ANE is to first do a batchelor of arts or science, then do a year's postgrad in archeology. So this year, I'm starting my BA in religious studies

You're on the right track, though I don't know there the archaeology comes in. That is, if you want to do ANE at the graduate level, the first step is to get a BA in something related. Religious studies is a good start. Then, once you have your degree, apply to the 10 or so programs in the US and Canada (assuming you're in or want to study in North America) and take a shot.

[adante]

That's the problem, I'm in Australia and I can't go to the US to study. Apart from I can't afford it, I don't want to leave my partner to do so. In Australia the whole subject is very small, so archeology or anthropology need to be studied to cover it. I've now changed to doing a double BA, one in religion studies and one in history, with mostly ancient history subjects. It does cover mostly Rome and such, but at least it gets me closer to what I want.

[us4-he2-gal2]

CONTACT!!!

YES! I have (I can't believe I'm saying this) made contact! With the ANE department in Toronto - I mean, I've emailed their entire staff by now, but whats surprising to me at this point is this: Someone got back to me with information! 0_0 Well, it took just over two months, but enclosed below is a letter from the very generous, very excellent Undergraduate & Office Administrator, and Assistant to the Chair (as they call them). She looked at Queen's for me, the university I am attending, and confirmed there is CRAP ALL for ANE studies - except one course I am already planning on for this summer. Afterwards, based on her advice, I think I am leaning towards a major in history and a minor in Hebrew studies and thats what I found useful from this exchange.


Here is the long sought after advice:



____________________________

Hello there,

The best preparation you can do for yourself is become as well versed in the ancient world as possible. I know you won't be able to take the language courses, but that is all right -- along those lines, you should prepare yourself with Biblical/Ancient Hebrew. That would be helpful. Also, any archaeology and history courses based on the study of ancient Mesopotamia will be helpful. I don't know what Queen's offers in this line, but you might find some courses offered through the Classics Department. Ancient Religions could be helpful too.

I'm just on the Queens website now, having a very, very quick look at some undergrad course offerings. These are what I would recommend:

CLST-207
CLST-208

Wow, that's literally all I see. Too bad, the ancient world is totally overlooked. Well, other than that, a good grounding in the humanities is helpful. A degree in Classics would be considered as suitable as possible, given the course offerings at Queens. Of course, you could also try some self-directed learning by picking up books on the topic, or a guide to learning Cuneiform.

Taking languages will ultimately be your best help, if you intend to attack a philological track in the future.

____________________________________________

[us4-he2-gal2]

_____________________________

Dear Bill,

Due to an error on QCARD you were allowed to register in CLST207 for the spring summer session. Unfortunately, you do not meet the stated prerequisite for this course so we have removed you from the course -- see below for the excerpt from the 2008-09 Arts and Science Calendar.
www.queensu.ca/calendars/artsci/pg156.html#48728
PREREQUISITES
Courses offered by the Department of Classics numbered 200-299 are not open to first-year students except by permission of the Department. Third- or fourth-year standing in a concentration in Classics, or permission of the Department are preferred for all 300- or 400-level courses. Placement in a course cannot be guaranteed without these options.

I apologize for the confusion, Bill. We have many other courses being offered by correspondence during the spring summer and hope that you will find a different course that you are interested in taking.



_____________________

[us4-he2-gal2]

Entering the U. of Toronto:

So it has been a while since I've written on this thread- while meeting with some initial frustrations early last year at Queen's, I nevertheless carried on and finished a year of German, Hebrew and Linguistics. There were often moments of high tension as I expierenced my first real uni. crunch periods but pulling through that, my marks we pretty good in the end - I decided to try for Toronto which has the only campus in this country that includes a small spot for the Ancient Near East. Sometime in the summer I got word of acceptance.


So in the spirit of this thread, which is more or less to relate stories of the struggle to be an Assyriologist (possibly for those readers considering this sort of obscure prospect), I will document some experiences at the new campus below. Toronto has the largest University campus in Canada, with over 70,000 students total. The relevant department in Toronto is called "The Department of Near and Middle Eastern Civilizations" - or NMC for short. Prior to 1996 this was known as the Near East Studies department (early in his career W.G. Lambert was a lecturer at the Toronto NES department), however the recent merger with Middle Eastern studies results in the department as it is today. One could likely suppose that the change is an effort to broaden the appeal of the department, just as individual courses have , in similar fashion, become more and more broad and general.


The campus at U of Toronto is often quite beautiful with old Victorian buildings and some wonderful Gothic architecture (revival period).

While some students live or study in these buildings, NMC students tend to inhabit more modest and humble structures (perhaps this is an unintentional analogy to projected income?). For example many of my classes are held in the very mundane Sidney Smith hall:

Architecture aside, I am very pleased with my situation at the uni. so far, studies of Mesopotamian culture are possible in the introductory courses: NMC101 gives a view of the history of the ANE (particularly Mesopotamia and Egypt), NMC260 an introduction to the archeology of the ANE (particularly Mesopotamia, the Levant and Egypt) and Biblical Hebrew is offered. Introductory Akkadian is offered every second year (I am unfortunate in missing it this year), Sumerian is unfortunately no longer offered.


A pleasant surprise for me at UofT has been the discovery that Professor Frayne is still actively involved in teaching
and offers a number of classes touching on Mesopotamian literature and history - certainly the chance to study with a Sumerologist of his stature was beyond my expectation. I was able to drop a course and switch to Frayne's NMC380 , an overview and comparative study of the Religions of different Near Eastern localities (including Mesopotamian and surprisingly Greece). Frayne's intent and message he explains is "Ex Oriente Lux" which means 'from the Orient shines' or something like that - the course will therefore demonstrate the influence of ANE religion on the west.




More in week two.

[alvean]

These are indeed wonderful things Frayne, Toronto, University, Assyriology... everything
wow!

[ummia-inim-gina]

This is very exciting please keep us posted!

[us4-he2-gal2]

Thanks guys Well, just to be clear, I am writing this record with the intention of documenting a process - Assyriology is such an obscure subject that it can seem impossible to approach. To me starting studies here has been a means to elaborate on a particular mode of toil, so of course far from an end unto itself. I guess theme of this thread is on "elaborating toil" . Success in Assyriology (at least I sometime think) comes only at retirement - if you can look back and see a substantial and mostly fulfilling career.


Week three at UofToronto is still an enjoyable and not overly taxing experience but this may be because I am already familiar with basic Hebrew - other students are pressed with Biblical Hebrew or dropping the course altogether. Courses in Egypt and ANE archaeology tend to focus on prehistory in the ANE in the first three weeks - in the latter course, sites in the Levant around 7000 to 6000 BC mainly but also Anatolia (particularly Catel Huyuk, which is the gem if prehistoric Archaeology and modern feminist pagan groups alike - which is irritating). I find my grasp of Biblical scholarship is limited and I am challenged in the introduction to Hebrew Literature course, but I am eager to learn. Lastly, Frayne's course on ANE religion is very enjoyable, and I think my reading here at enenuru has more than prepared me for the subject matter. The Professor is engaging and knowledgeable, with a sharp mind for language matters, he is able to read out loud from cuneiform texts with little problem - his particular angle in the course is broad comparisons of religious themes usually eminating from Mesopotamia to western cultures. I recently learned that he was a student of Hallo and this makes perfect sense as Hallo was a defendant of maximalist theories of interpretation - I've always been fond of this stance, for more on that see the following thread, post #2:

enenuru.proboards.com/index.cgi?action=display&board=topics&thread=56&page=1



Regrettably, few in the class are read on Mesopotamia nor do they seem overly interested in it - some may be Religion studies students or Anthropologists or the like just taking that extra credit. Ironically, Mesopotamian enthusiasts are a minority (even in a classroom on such a theme as the influence of Mesopotamian on the west!).



Paper writing is already starting to worry me in week three as they the effort to produce content for them will be hitting soon - the preasure there seems to build far before the knowledge you are receiving. I suppose I'd better learn how real students juggle writing demands with the ongoing heavy reading and quizzes hm

[us4-he2-gal2]

Week 7:

This time of paper writing seems to be upon me this week, I'd have to say its something sort of new and yet to a reasonable extent familiar to me. The work at enenuru has really put me in a good mode for this sort of challenge, I can't say I will get good marks or observe all of the conventions of writing a 1st year academic paper without some effort, but I am at least comfortable already with the demand of formulating academic points and so on.

I am writing about Egypt for NMC101, introduction to the Ancient Near East (this semester it is Egyptian History and Culture , next semester Mesopotamian). I've decided to look in to Egyptian Magic and specifically the lessor studied subject of Black Magic in Egyptian Literature - some preliminary reading has alerted me to the possibility of exploring "Voodoo Death" in Egyptian contexts, this is a Anthropological term relating to findings that in some aboriginal cultures, persons with a complete faith in the effectiveness of magic and witchcraft could, upon believing themselves cursed, enter such a state of fear and depression that death could result - thus in some cultures magic could really kill (due to an extreme pyschosomatic reaction). I have alot of ground to cover as I am not sure that I have sufficient source material - yet its only a first year paper to be between 4 and 5 pages... So will post results here of course once its done

[us4-he2-gal2]

Entering the U. of Jena

It has certainly been some time since I update this thread, some 4 years since I have been studying at the University of Toronto. Of course, many readers here are aware of how studies there have been proceeding, for one thing I have been uploading my papers to enenuru at the end of every semester. Some of you may not be aware that I have spent a solid year from Sept. 2013 to Sept. 2014 planning a trip to study in Jena, Germany during the 2014/2015 academic year.


While I have spent years now attempting to build a foundation in Mesopotamian studies, this really came about by a stroke of good luck. A friend of mine from the U. of Toronto, Richard, set up in Jena and has been studying with Prof. Krebernik for some time. Richard encouraged me to seriously consider a trip to Germany and, after much diplomacy and planning, it has finally come about. It is a real privilege to study Sumerian under a great scholar like Prof. Krebernik who we know here as the only scholar to ever translate the Early Dynastic incantation texts - and a challenge I take very seriously. As I am just a visiting student, will have to make these 10 months count.



So as is my custom I will show a few pics of the the University - any interested are welcome to visit my travel blog at:

lukurkurra.blogspot.de

The inner courtyard of the University "Hauptgebäude" (or administraive building) has a medieval feel to it and is probably one of the older parts of the building. The university was founded in the mid-1500s.





As Jena is a German university town, there is this statue of the founder of the university in the market square, his name was Johann Friedrich.






Here is a picture looking out from the Institute window.

[madness]

Jena looks like a great place. How much different is it to Toronto?

[us4-he2-gal2]

Well in terms of the culture, I think Germans have an excellent sense of hospitality - people may pay for you if they have made the invitation to go out for example, table manners and etiquette are usually noticeable, people wait until all are done eating before leaving the table and so forth (particular on semi-formal occasions). Although this is not in contrast with the situation in Toronto really at least among groups that I know. It's been a nice experience so far as a guest in the country, people at the institute are welcoming to newcomers, patient with my German problems and always seem pleased that someone has a real interest and enjoyment of their culture and city.


So far as the university is concerned, the differences between the German and North American systems are numerous. In N. America, the school year *seems* shorter in terms of in class weeks, but it's really not...actually, I have realized, the N. American school year is perhaps more logically distributed. In Toronto, semester 1 goes from Sept. to Dec. , 2 week Christmas break, then semester 2 goes from Jan to April. Each semester is 13 weeks. In Germany, semester 1 goes from Nov (although registration is in Oct) to mid February (with 2 weeks Christmas break), then a 1 1/2 month semester break, then from mid April to mid July. So the actual in class time of the German semester ends up being about 13 weeks per semester as well, however the German school year spans a significantly longer part of the year because of the breaks etc. German university costs almost nothing (I pay 170 euros per semester in fees) meaning German students have less of a debt to deal with once school is done - a downside is that German universities tend to be short on cash when it comes time to fund PhD students. Another major difference is that Canadian professors must issue their students mid-term tests, a few small tests and a term paper or project, in addition to the term final so the overall mark is an average of these different things; German professors, on the other hand, have no such obligations and as a result you can expect a singular test at the end of your German course worth (basically) your entire mark! 0_0 So, in other words, don't blow that test.

It has been highly educational so far, I am immersed in the challenge of learning 3 ancient languages through the medium of a foreign (to me) language. In semester 1 I have perhaps bitten off too much and do not have enough time or resource to really systematize what I am being exposed to. Semester 2 therefore must be more carefully balanced.

[mesopotamiankaraite]

Congratulations on how far you've come and good luck your studies!

[svladu]

Hello! I am glad I found the enenuru site and this forum. I am, at most, a self-training passionate, it is a bit much to say „assyriologist". I am past my university studies, though not by many years, I still have some hope that someday I will have the possibility and time to study this in formal institution. I have read some books on assyriology in my native language (I live in Romania), but they all date from the 60's, 70's and 80's. That's why I extended a proposition to one of the major general publishing houses in my country (and they agreed) to translate van de Mieroop's Synthesis, so I am currently working on that till March. In the meantime I am working my way slowly (three signs a day) through Snell's Workbook.

My future plans involve the study of akkadian for the next 2 years and then the study of sumerian proper. I am considering these long time plans, because I also have my hands tied at work and at home with my family. So that's that, I chose not to hurry. It is a bit frustrating, though.

I also have a tattoo with the god UTU on my leg:
imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/270x360q90/907/38wi7v.jpg.

[sheshki]

Hello svladu,

welcome on board. I hope you will find useful information here. 3 signs a day is quite fast...i took way more time with the book, filled pages and pages with the signs.
You can have a look at my/our struggle here

Greetings

Sheshki

Oh and, nice tattoo

[us4-he2-gal2]

Svladu:




Welcome to enenuru! Yes, by the sounds of it, you certainly belong here. As I explain in my orientation area and everywhere, enenuru is a group dedicated to bridging the gap between the academic and layman worlds, and to those making this kind of transition. Van de Mieroop's "A History of the Ancient Near East" is an important work which is always required reading for students here in Toronto, so I applaud your efforts to bring the book to Romanian speakers


As for learning strategies, I would be happy to consult with you about that, Akkadian grammar, Sumerian grammar, how it is done at the University of Toronto and so forth. Also I can provide learning materials. Feel free to post here, or e-mail: [e-mail]



P.S. Yes quite a fantastic Utu tattoo, vibrant and representative. The most eccentric students get Mesopotamian tattoos (myself included).

[lammasu]

Hello everyone !


As a fellow canadian who would like to study assyriology, I cannot overstate how happy I am to have found this forum, and this particular thread as well. I'm currently studying history in Québec's cégep system, which means that I need to make a choice regarding university in the near future (Cégeps are a mandatory pre-university institution for Quebec's students). As I was contemplating the undergraduate options that are offered in my province, I quickly came with the conclusions that the ANE is grossly overlooked. I tried to write to UQAM's ''Association des études du Proche-Orient ancien'', but no reply so far. At this point, i'm considering a major in linguistics with a minor in religious studies, which will provide some training in biblical hebrew.


I am aware that this thread was created in 2008, and that the last reply is from 2016, but if this is not too indiscreet from me, i'd be curious to learn more about your academic experience in Canada. What would be your advice for someone who can't do any undergrad in a program directly about the history and languages of Mesopotamia, such as ''Near and Middle Eastern Civilisations'' from U of T ?

[us4-he2-gal2]

Hello Lammasu:



I am vaguely aware of the cégep system as I have had a few acquaintances who have gone through the system. But generally, I am confused by the Quebec schooling system and can't keep track of French schools. I know that one of the French-Canadian Ph.D students here (I guess she is now post-graduate), Odette Boivin, used to teach an introductory Akkadian course at a French university (I can't recall which one, I will post it below after asking her). This was several years ago. She would travel by train back and forth from Toronto to Quebec where she taught this one Assyriological course. So really, NMC in Toronto is the only department that offers the chance for an Assyriological degree, but occasionally a relevant course is taught elsewhere.

I'd be happy to discuss my academic history. Well, I think we started in a very similar situation, as do all Canadians wanting to study Assyriology who don't start in Toronto. I was in Kingston Ont., at Queen's University, when I started and there were no ancient Near Eastern course offerings. So I majored in Linguistics, I took one year of courses at an introductory level (and for some reason, I enrolled in an advanced Phonetics course at the same time, which was a mistake. It's never a good idea to take courses out of order). I also did introductory Modern Hebrew that first year, I would have taken Biblical Hebrew, but it wasn't offered. My advice would be to go the way you are going, the same fields that I felt were the best preparation for later ANE studies.

If you are able, transfer to Toronto and to the Department of Near and Middle Eastern Studies (NMC) as soon as possible. I was able to transfer from Queen's to Toronto in the summer after completing one year at Queen's. Usually, I don't think it is a problem to get accepted at Toronto, they don't require a high grade level really, like all universities here, UofT is a money making machine, they want undergraduates. Obviously, one should strive for the highest grades in any case. The difficulty is sometimes of a practical nature. Rent in Toronto and also tuition at Toronto is really expensive and the OSAP student loan is not enough. As an undergrad in Toronto, I was given about $13,000 from OSAP per year (quite below minimum wage), and from that $13,000 I had to pay about $8,000 in tuition fees. That would leave me $5,000 to live on throughout the school year, and the summer to! That's not nearly enough to pay rent, and not enough to buy groceries either. Fortunately for me, my girlfriend, who moved with me to Toronto, worked and supported me financially through it all, which I am very grateful for. But yes.. there are real practical difficulties to contend with.

Most students who end up studying Assyriology have a mixture of different studies in their past - most did an undergraduate in some other field and then realized later they wanted to do Assyriology, and begin taking relevant courses at the MA level. That I chose courses single mindedly with the goal of working toward Assyriology was very rare. It is preferable but not necessary. One should understand also that NMC is terribly short of students, and always looking for more undergrads and MAs, as many as they can get. A small number of Ph.D students are accepted in NMC each year (but only a small number of Ph.D students apply). If you are able to transfer to Toronto and do 2,3 or 4 years in NMC as an undergrad, this would be ideal - although, the amount of Akkadian and Sumerian language courses you are able to do as an undergrad is limited (undergrads are limited to intro Akkadian, which takes 1 year. Sumerian is graduate only, in fact). However, if you do 2,3 or even 4 years in Quebec in Linguistics, this is not a problem either, especially if you pick up Biblical Hebrew, which has been considered a pre-requisite (now optional pre-requisite) for Akkadian. Professors in Assyriology respect and admire training in Linguistics, often they learn what they can and apply Linguistics although they may not have formal training in it themselves. The late Prof. Frayne used to tell me that he thought one year in Linguistics should be mandatory for ANE students. Entering NMC at the MA level with a undergrad degree in Linguistics would position you well and would be considered better training than many have when they start an MA in Assyriology.


My feeling is that a third and forth year of Linguistics would be more training in that field than one would need for the purposes of augmenting one's Assyriological approach - a problem is that Linguistics is very scientific and demanding endeavor in itself, and the further you go in it, the more you must invest intellectually.


Irregardless of what choices you make or when you plan on coming in contact with Akkadian or Sumerian, independent study of cuneiform is a good idea also. The cuneiform writing system is very, very complex and difficult and is one the biggest, perhaps the biggest, challenge for any student. It will make or break you. Working with the signs on your own and becoming familiar with the basics and the difficulties ahead of time can be a great advantage.




Feel free to contact me here or at [e-mail] for further questions or discussion.

[us4-he2-gal2]

Odette replied to me about which school she taught at in Quebec:



"It was UQÀM (Université du Québec à Montréal). There is an Egyptologist there but a course on Syro-Palestine and one on Mesopotamia are also offered every other year normally (in the history department)."