The Quiz Thread - win e-points!

[us4-he2-gal2]

Thread Orientation: On this thread we can practice doing some basic translations

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Greetz:








Noting some recent ambitions from our German community here I thought a quiz thread was in order - The idea is that any approaching Akkadian (new students or layman) might put have a reason to make a translation for perhaps the first time. *If you have a reason to make a translation you are more likely to try and make one..and trying to make translations is what its all about*



I realize of course that this challange would be better if I had been able to bring the Akkadian: victoria aut mors sections into a better state of completion - must explain that my delays here have been by necessity. I had to stop and learn myself before posting or Beaulieu would grade me even more harshly 0_0


Nonetheless for those with Akkadian text books translate and win e-points (that is eccentric points). No shame in making any mistakes! We learn when we make mistakes.

[us4-he2-gal2]

Quiz 1

So before asking the first line to be translated, maybe I can remind those learners who are even newer than me of the standard pronouns used in Akkadian - words meaning I, you, he, she, we, they and so on. Remember M = male, F = female and C = common (same word used for both genders), S = singular , P = plural:

1CS: anāku = I
2MS: atta = you (ms)
2FS: atti = you (fs)
3MS: šū = he, it (m)
3FS: šī = she, it (f)



1CP: nīnu = we
2MP: attunu = you (mp)
2FP: attina = you (fp)
3MP: šunu = they (m)
3FP: šina = they (f)

*** And remember that ša can be a few things in Akkadian, but in these early exercises, is used in the genitive sense = "of"




So here is the first line to translate:

amātum ša bēlim anāku u attina

Sooo.. reply with your best translation below

[lilitudemon]

What are "e-points"?

[sheshki]

well "e-points" are Enenuru-points...or "e"maginary points.

amātum ša bēlim anāku u attina

amātum ša bēlim prolly means "the word of god" but the rest i dont get. anāku u attina...i and you? no idea what you mean bill.

[us4-he2-gal2]

amātum ša bēlim anāku u attina




Not bad Sheshki! This is getting us quite close, but two small things are off so lets examine those.

For the meaning "words" you would need the word awātum - here though we have amātum which is "female slaves'" (singular is amtum, "female slave"). The second thing is that bēlim (normally bēlum when he is the subject of the sentance), means "lord" - so you can call the god of the Bible lord, but you can't call a lord in cuneiform literature god

So you are playing with the words and searching for the logic - this is the challenge for sure.

The meaning of this sentence is "You and I (are) slaves of the Lord" or "the Lord's slaves" .

Akkadian does not express "to be" or "are" as English does - this has to be assumed by the reader. Another thing, since the word for slave here is specifically female slave, it can be assumed both the speaker and the ones she is talking to are female.



Ok so 10 E-points for Sheshki! on to quiz 2

[us4-he2-gal2]

Quiz 2

Even more quiziness than before:

bēlum ša ālim anāku

[Salmu]

Well Bill, time I weighed in on this thread I guess, (moral support for the German dude).

In your phrase;

amātum ša bēlim anāku u attina

Firstly, amātu(m) appears to my rusty understanding to be a singular (nominative) masculine noun. The masc. plural in Caplice (p. 14) and Worthington (pp. 37-38) is given as ū, this would thus be rendered as amātū. The feminine, however, takes ātu(m), but the feminine made absolutely no sense, as we needed number (plural) and case (nominative) to match 'I and you' for your translation.

So I had nominative singular (subject) '(the) word' + genitive ' of (the) lord'(with ša) + I and you (both obviously nominative singular personal pronouns). Did not make sense (the verb gapping was a given).

Also, on that subject, since we are dealing with a Semitic language, which naturally has the capacity for the dual form, why here does the noun not match the actual number and carry a dual suffix?...then subject and number would match for the two personal pronouns (I and you), and we would all easily see what is intended (and it's important to be very consistent when learning/practicing these notions, especially when we are coming from languages that have no concept of the dual).

Secondly, amātu(m) 'word' occurs as a derived form (read Ishtars descent dude) of awātu(m) (Worthington pp. 342-343) in texts from after the Old Babylonian period (I think, maybe Middle, but you get my drift).

In addition, 'slave' is rendered as amtu(m) in Worthington and Caplice, the plural form may well be what we see here but it is cited in both as feminine, 'female slave', which in no way matches the gender(s) seen here. And as Semitic languages are always default masculine that did not therefore seem to be a viable option.


Cheers A

[sheshki]

Wee, 10 e-points...i´m rich...i guess.

Ok, second one...according to Worthington´s glossary your
bēlum ša ālim anāku could mean "I am the ruler of the city"

Let me break it down a bit:

bēlu(m)- lord, master, owner
ša- of
ālim- genitive form of town, city
anāku- i (am)

K dude, hand over more e-points

[sheshki]

Ok Bill,
here is our counterchallenge, erm , i mean... a quiz for you (of course every boardmember is invited to join in)
Transliterate and translate the sentence below, for glory and e-points!

[us4-he2-gal2]

First I must reply to Andrea who wrote reply # 6 of this thread:



Andrea - you are the perfect combination of feisty woman well on the way to becoming the most feisty of feisty sorts of scholar (of course in a field now dedicated to digging up and correcting its own mistakes this is probably a good thing).

While your feistiness is therefore entirely in keeping with it all, I'm probably not going to be modifying any sentences from Quiz 1 or Quiz 2. All sentences are practice exercises taken directly from Huehnergard and I believe my plural of amtum is just fine.


If I start to creating my own sentences at some point I'd certainly invite your critic though.

[us4-he2-gal2]

As for you Frank - Challlange accepted. Will try and take a look tonight before Santa gets here

[us4-he2-gal2]

So as for Quiz 2 - the translation given above is correct: "I am the lord (or ruler) of the city." So 10 e-points to Sheski!



As for your counter challenge, let me first check my transliteration:


DINGIR im/em- il- ik ru-ba-am ?

[sheshki]

Transliteration accepted!

[us4-he2-gal2]

Alright I'm not sure what that is. My guess is a god who is noble?

[sheshki]

Well Bill, looks like no e-points for you. According to "Introduction to Akkadian" by R.Caplice it means "May Adad bless (me).

[us4-he2-gal2]

Well you picked a hard one - everyone knows the writing of the storm god's name is a pain in the ass! 0_0




DINGIR im/em- il- ik ru-ba-am


Looks like I made small mistake in my transliteration - wrote il instead of li for the 3rd sign. Should be:

DINGIR im/em- li- ik ru-ba-am


So I didn't recognize the divine name or the root of the verb k-r-b = bless ; but now it makes sense.

DINGIR IM = Adad. The verb has a precative and and a ventive suffix which modify its meaning. If you just have ikrub (3MS) this means "he blessed" . If you add the "li" and make it "li ikrub" (precative 3MS) it means "may he bless" ; adding the ventive suffix on the end gives the action a direction , -am is 1person so "
li ikrubam = "may he bless me"

[madness]

Try this one:

išpikku zê ṣarritim

[us4-he2-gal2]

Okay so išpakku is probably the verb (though usually that is at the end of the clause) and its G stem, preterit 3MS, with maybe a 2MS dative suffix (-ku).

So the verb is probably šapākum which means to heap up, pile up or store, or to pour.

i (=he) špak (piled/poured) ku (you) --

So he poured you out.


Is this in any way right so far?

[madness]

No, it's a special kind of bucket

[darkl2030]

Here's a line I did recently, bonus points if you guess where its from.

a-na la si-ma-ti-šu taš-ku-ni-iš a-na pa-ra-aṣ (d)A-nu-ti

[us4-he2-gal2]

Hm ok. challenge accepted By the way, your welcome to contribute anonymously especially with what seems like really good insight into the field - but I've found the most lasting members seem also have some social stake in the group. Hence I would welcome a post on our introductions thread as well:


Introductions

[us4-he2-gal2]

First - Madness for some reason your challenge stumps me. But getting stuck and making errors and all that are a big part of learning Akkadian in my opinion. This latest challenge I can at least find some likely grammatical explanations for so lets see.

a-na la si-ma-ti-šu taš-ku-ni-iš a-na pa-ra-aṣ (d)A-nu-ti

ana lā simatīšu taškuniš ana paraṣ Anuti[/color]


Word Analysis:



simatīšu - bound form of simtum, genitive, 3MS possessive suffix = "his or it's worth, appropriatness, suitability.

taškuniš - from šakānum, 2MS, g preterite, with terminative-adverbial suffix -iš ? Huehnergard only gives an example of this on an infinitive verb "amāriš - (in order) to see" and so I'm not sure what we have here with a preterite ending in -iš.

lā - Adverb of Negation - I would interpret it as negating an individual noun in this case (simatīšu) , as the example Huehnergard gives on page 199: ṭēmum lā damqum imqutam 'an unfavorable report reached me.'

paraṣ - bound form of parṣum (custom, office, rite).




Translation attempts:



"(What) you have established is unfit/unsuitable for the rite of Anuti."


Or perhaps if the -iš suffix is interpreted as Hughnergard's amāriš (in order) to see) (pg. 311):

"(That which) you have established in order for the rite of Anuti is unsuitable (or - does not suit him?)."

[darkl2030]

Good job, I really can't find any fault in your translation. But not quite correct, and I now realize that it may be quite difficult to get a sentence like this exactly right without having the full context. And of course, there is the issue of the -iš, which is not here the adverbial/terminative ending but actually a archaizing way of expressing a quite common suffix found on verbs. Huenergahrd mentions the possibility of a related suffix showing up this way for nouns in his chapter 30.2, e), but for some reason he doesn't discuss this happening for verbs (which I think is fairly common in litterary texts). I was just now trying to find the section for this in von Soden but was unable to, but manuscript variant apparently does give the usual form of the suffix so at least that makes me less scared I'm completely wrong here. Hopefully I can find it in writing later. But as for the function of "Anuti", you should check line 11 of the prologue to the code of Hammurabi for a clue. I will also give you preceeding and following lines from this passage for more contextual help, but this should make it pretty obvious where this comes from.

tab-be2-ma (d)kin-gu a-na ha-'i-ru-ti-ki
a-na la si-ma-ti-šu taš-ku-ni-iš a-na pa-ra-aṣ (d)A-nu-ti
a-na an-šar2 LUGAL DINGIR.DINGIR lem-ne2-e-ti te-eš-e-ma

[darkl2030]

Pages 53-54 of von Soden's GAG for the -š

[us4-he2-gal2]

Whew - glad I wasn't realllyyy far off. Well no one has ever really challenged me to refine a translation, so I'll give it a go! You have definitely uped the stakes Darkl -


I have a mid-term in Akkadian tomorrow morning so will have to pause until at least tomorrow night though

[darkl2030]

Well, time is running out to have a good translation of these lines, I'll have to just reveal the answer if I don't hear soon. Also I'd love to try a challenge if anyone has one.

[us4-he2-gal2]

DarkL:




This was definitely tricky even with the hints 0_0 I do have GAG but can't read it as well as I'd like to as my German is developing. I did look up about Anuti - there was a similar line involving Enlil. Are we talking about an abstract -ūt ? In which case it may be something like the "Enlilship" or some such - I'm not sure that is whats going on with Anuti at moment so I've left it another question mark.

Unfortunately I leave alot of question marks on this second attempt, the lack of obvious S. O. V (Subject Object Verb) sentence structure has thrown me, in addition to the heavy use of the ana preposition, which has like 16 possible interpretations or so according to the Concise Dictionary of Akkadian. And yet this is some of the first real literary stuff I've tried and literary stuff is my ultimate goal - so this is quite valuable and I will look for your corrections with interest. Especially since my translation still doesn't make obvious sense to me.





1. tab-be2-ma (d)kin-gu a-na ha-'i-ru-ti-ki
2. a-na la si-ma-ti-šu taš-ku-ni-iš a-na pa-ra-aṣ (d)A-nu-ti
3. a-na an-šar2 LUGAL DINGIR.DINGIR lem-ne2-e-ti te-eš-e-ma



Line 1. tabbê-ma Kingu ana ḫâ'irûtīki


tabbê-ma - ? Can't figure this verb out. I almost wanted to say a stative D Stem of tebûm or something, but then it's an a vowel not u. But by context, I will put something like "raised?"

ana of purpose - 'for'

ḫâ'irûtīka - from noun ḫâ'irûtu 'status of spouse' (Concise Dictionary of Akkadian), plus 2FS possessive suffix.


Line 2. see earlier post


Line 3: ana Anšar šar īlī lemneti tešê-ma

te-eš-e-ma - from ešum ? to confuse, 2fs.




Translation:



(you raised?) ? Kingu for your spouse

You established (that which is?) unsuitable to him (..to Anu?)

You confused the rites of Anu (or 'godship'?) for Anšar, king of the evil gods.






Of course, that part about Anšar, for example, doesn't seem right for the story of the Enuma Elish hm.

[darkl2030]

1. tab-be2-ma (d)kin-gu a-na ha-'i-ru-ti-ki
2. a-na la si-ma-ti-šu taš-ku-ni-iš a-na pa-ra-aṣ (d)A-nu-ti
3. a-na an-šar2 LUGAL DINGIR.DINGIR lem-ne2-e-ti te-eš-e-ma


Line 1. tabbê-ma Kingu ana ḫâ'irûtīki

A stative of tebû won't cut it, because, as you said, that wouldn't give a geminated middle radical, and we'd also (usually) expect e-vocalism. I doubt there is such thing as a D-stative for this verb either. Rule of thumb when you see what looks like a geminated radical--don't forget to check verbs-primae N! Especially when its a commonly occuring verb as here. Here we have simply a second person preterite of nabû, to name. You are correct about ḫâ'irûtu, which is formed from an abstrative suffix on hiaarum, "to choose, to seek in marriage."

"You named Kingu as your spouse."

Line 2: ana lā simatīšu taškuniš ana paraṣ Anuti

Its usually easier to just stick with "to" or "for" for ana as you are translating, and then refine it later if you want. If you look at the paradigm I referred to you from von Soden, he gives simply -š as an alternate form (common in Old Akkadian, and somewhat common in litterary texts) of the simple accusative pronominal suffix "-šu." Much more commonly they do this for the possesive -šu on nouns. The -i- gets inserted to avoid an impossible *-nš. So this was a crucial point you were missing in your translation . This is odd word order, yes, but you can still render it in english in the same order and have it come out understandable.

"to (that which is) unsuitable for him you set him -- to the rites of Anu-ship."
or "you set him to something unsuitable for him, to the rites of Anu-ship."

Line 3: ana Anšar šar īlī lemneti teš'e-ma

Well, you transliterated it as if it was third weak, but then you choose a primae-weak verb? It's actually the II- and III-weak še'û here, "to seek", conjugated like le'û (Huehnergard pg.635). The index in the beggining of CDA is your friend.

"for Anshar, king of the gods, you sought out evil."

My translation:
You named Kingu as your spouse.
You set him to something unsuitable for him, to the rites of Anu-ship.
For Anshar, king of the gods, you sought out evil.

Stephanie Dalley's translation: pg. 253 of Myths from Mesopotamia.
You named Qingu as your lover,
You appointed him to rites of Anu-power, wrongfully his.
You sought out evil for Anshar, king of the gods.

This comes from Tablet IV of Enuma Elish.

[us4-he2-gal2]

OK - wish I had time to be more creative and artful with this, but I'll just throw something up for kicks:

mi-im-ma ša te-pu-ša-an-ni ^dIŠKUR il-ka li-id-dam-mi-iq.

[darkl2030]

"Whatever you do to me, may it be favorable to ISHKUR, your god" is the best I can make of it. What's it from?